>should have left that shit in 5th grade why? that was one of the best times in my life continuous probing of environment and simultaneous action in response is the basis of all mechanical processing and thus thought. consciousness is the opposite of thought and occurs when thinking is otherwise impossible to create a new and separate "mind-space" to facilitate action. beings do not "have consciousness" as they "have" instincts, they are forced to become conscious of foreign objects to which there exist no instinctual reactions. in the case of humanity this has mainly manifested in the eye schema (as vision is the most remote sense) tho the ear is (was) returning (returned) tho this has somewhat reversed with bizarre effects. we have created a new world-environment (see from cliche to archetype "satellite imaging of the earth turns the planet into a stage to be programmed") which we are all collectively lost in

What is stopping them for having consciousness ??? If we do, they likely do have too.

If fish dont have consciousness explain the piraputanga. So crazy.

>>76 each and every one of these "experiments" for animals learning language or math that i've seen eventually came down to very liberal interpretation by the handler/researcher, or downright just a human pressing the buttons. i tend to follow the same reasoning as >>41 but at the end of the day we cannot really prove anything related to something so subjective as the experience of being alive.

>>73 "instinctual machines" dont exist among animals, maybe arthropods, spiders are kinda stupid imo I think defining consciousness as like "a state in which a creature is ready to change its pattern of behavior", a transitional state that when elongated out of necessity, i would say that tgat is where humans trump the rest of the animal kingdom, it doesnt have as much to do with attention span, pigs would have us beat, but its about chaining thoughts and figuring complicated things out in an involved manner, exposing the workings of the brain and not simply stopping for a moment and getting an answer from a background process if you understand what i am saying, if somebody tells you to calculate 5*12 you kind of just know that its 60, you dont need to think much because its not a large complex system, especially one that involves yourself as a moving part and you know, if we go with that consciousness appears to be a prerequisite for all animals that have place in the middle of the food chain, alternating between prey and predatory behavior, discovering behavior, migratory behavior.

>The silver lining is that they are probably more broken inside and that they will probably mess up badly in the future, maybe karma is building up to bite them in the back? I still believe good will win, even if evil reigns for long. Like I said, If we want good to win, Then it's on us to push for it rather than just hoping that good will win. As Joshua Graham would say, "You can't except God to do all the work". It's on you to make that change.

>>39 that's true, I heard of a parable where God condemned people who did not do much with their time, despite having the ability to do better, over time, I feel like I've realized that I have too money and too little time, it sucks

what do you mean by karma? if we take the simplest popular definition - that its basically just cause and effect - why would you not believe in it? if a person does something bad then it makes world worse and then they have to live in a worse off world thats karma and there 0 superstitious elements in this defenition >>33 you say it as if thats all shes done in her life bully you and "win" whatever that means

karma does traditionally mean causation but more importantly the unknown and persistant influence of conscious action on an unconscious environment and applied both to mental as physical actions. especially in buddhism mind is listed the sixth sense an thus part of the world-environment is made of unconscious mind-stuff (actually technically all of reality is "mind" and there is no mental-physical dualism). the description and confusion about good and bad and what happens from them are malformed interpretations of environmental transferrance (karma). every action is far more particular than "a good action", a bad action however while also particular is simply bad. evil is not bad but the form of being when bad has become good by posessing/deceiving acting consciousness (the maker of environments). to consciousness good always prevails and always to the 'detriment' (catastrophic rebuilding) of environment. bad (not evil which is consciousness manifest) prevails in proportion to the degree of diminishing consciousness.

>>57 if i evade taxes i lose a little and gain a lot, because everybody else is shoulderimg the burden with me retard

>4-ch I made one or two threads there. Otherwise, always used Vampiros.xyz (I think it's .org now?). Never heard about the others.

I'm not much of an oldfag since I discovered a lot of the old textboards while chan-surfing during Covid, but I still use 4-ch and world2ch. World2ch is the more active one, although the only really active textboard I've been able to find is the Strange World / Ayashii Warudo area that the Heyaoians run

It seems the roflcopter is a bit deformed. Damaged heavily in battle flying through teh interwebz.

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I don't know

i basically always have to try to study so i don't understand the question. studying for me is always a conscious effort, even if it's easier at times than others.

>>18 Same software

>>2 There shouldn't be any constant of numbers (like how this post is no. 20). I know everythread starts at 1 as it should, but this should be the only numbering system(that is shown anyways). I'm testing to see if replying to in thread posts works too.

>but this should be the only numbering system(that is shown anyways) It's not like that because it's still using the same stuff that the image boards use and it's too much of a hassle I'm not bothered to deal with. Also I prefer the futaba numbering system.

>Also I prefer the futaba numbering system. Then I'll make you into a futaba numbering system

>>4 I am not really optimistic. It looks to me as if most younger people neglect participating in more bureaucratic forms of education. It really disturbs me to witness the normalization and the promotion of cluster B personalities in the system. I don't know whats going to happen, but it doesn't look good. We are more connected and yet more disconnected in general; social media removed unity in thought, I don't know what's to hope for. We really need a belief system, because the world in general looks bleak to me.

We find ourselves at a pivotal moment in history where the sinners are cast aside for the righteous. In other words, those who cling to desperation and greed will miss what's happening now and will be doomed to failure. It's pointless to predict what the future will hold. One can only guess what will happen, but a better option is to make a choice on what is happening right now in front of you. I know that the present also pushes back at us, too, but let us not forget what we can do to fight back, our desire in our hearts. Our passion and creativity. I myself find myself the most successful in life when I am working my hardest to create what I want to and what I love doing. That is why it is essential not only to be unafraid to make decisions but also to have unwavering determination that you will come out on top in the end. Forget all these doomsayers who try to predict this dreadful future! Don't let them stop you from doing what you love. Always focus on what you love doing and you will succeed in the end.

>>4 def worse unless we do some kind of a revolution we are screwed chances are most of us wont see 22nd century i hope however that the internet exposing fakeness and poinlessness of all of these wars will foster a global pacifist movement it would be nice at least if more nations adopted japanese style constitutional ban on war

>>47 >I hope you realize I never mentioned anything about money. That is tiring, yes. The point was less about money, and more about the fact that art has degraded to such a point where "fine art" is less about actually having skill and more about sniffing your own farts over the """deep""" meaning your """artwork""" has.

>>28 >The purpose of a language is to transfer information, the purpose of music is to express your emotions. One's emotions can be very important information, and languages provide various tools to communicate them (some more than others). No wonder why poetry and literature exist. Music has also been used for the purpose of sharing information effectively, through stuff like mnemonics, rhymes, jingles... Even the Illiad had a rhythm to it, so poets/singers/bards could have an easier time remembering the entirety of it, since it's so long. Having said that, both music and human languages can be used for both transferring information and expressing emotions. They are just different ways of doing the same thing. >Music is just noise Music is not just about the sound, but I'm sure you know that. It would be a pointless exercise to try and define what else it is about anyway. >>48 I think people are able to appreciate both Romantic (as in Romanticism) paintings and more abstract art that challenge what "art" means. Refining the existing wisdom, and challenging the existing wisdom are both equally important for said wisdom. And yes, unfortunately for you, art not having rules or standards also means that there will be art you don't like. Too bad, such is the consequence of freedom. >art has degraded to such a point where "fine art" is less about actually having skill and more about sniffing your own farts over the """deep""" meaning your """artwork""" has. Maybe, just maybe, artists are trying novel ways to express emotions they have always tried to express. Emotions that artists have been expressing since art has been conceived. Because mind you, art was never only about how it looks; The beautiful paintings from the 1800s and early 1900s (I'm assuming) you like so much have as much emotion put into them as the newer stuff you see nowadays, or have been seeing since the 40s, 50s and 60s. So-called "deep meaning" has always been a part of art, it's just that nowadays people have tried to bring that "deep meaning" forward more, without worrying so much about how it will look. Which is also art.

>>49 Forgot to answer the OP >>10 >Was music an offshoot of language? Or language that of music? I have read somewhere that, as far as human evolution goes, music came before language, so at the very least language was an offshoot of music. But I think it's also possible that language merely used certain aspects of music, but developed separately from it. Or maybe that's just what an offshoot is. idk >There are some places in the world that condemn music, but ordinary people still practice it. Anyone that is powerful and brazen enough will attempt to control and restrict communication. Music is a tool for communication, but not many people consider it one, so it's easier to restrict its use without people being bothered by it. Restricting language directly a la 1984 would be too obvious, and people would revolt too quickly. >Would you be able to imagine your life without music? Absolutely not lol

>>49 I can understand that not all art is to my taste. Notice I never glazed any specific period or style of art. I don't need to enjoy all art. But a prime example of my point is this: >https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fountain_(Duchamp) This is literally a toilet. A toilet, made in a factory. Not custom made or sculpted, a standard urnial for its time. Lauded as some grand piece of artwork because of the """""deep""""" meaning it has. You can justify ANYTHING as being art as long as you BS some kind of message about it. I could take a literal turd, smear it on the wall like a coked up chimpanzee, and as long as I make up some crap (get it) "meaning" about it, supposedly this puts it on the same level as the great artwork of the past. >Such is the consequence of freedom If my point above is the logical conclusion of your statement then art is better off with less freedom. I stand by that. Art is equal parts aesthetics and meaning, interwoven together into a transcendental form. Art without meaning is vapid (corporate art for example) but art without aesthetics is a disgrace.

>>51 >Lauded as some grand piece of artwork because of the """""deep""""" meaning it has. I think this quote here from the wikipedia page you linked is important: >Whether Mr Mutt with his own hands made the fountain or not has no importance. He CHOSE it. He took an ordinary article of life, placed it so that its useful significance disappeared under the new title and point of view – created a new thought for that object. That is, maybe the whole point of Fountain, whether you consider it art or not, is to start a conversation about what "art" is. Because no one knows exactly what it is. Or should I say, everyone knows, but each person defines it differently. So to start, can a standard, factory-made urinal be art? Maybe not, right? So what if I instead rotated it 90 degrees and gave it a new name, "Fountain", created "a new thought" for it, signed it under my name, and put it on a pedestal. Now what? Is it still a urinal, or has it become "Fountain"? Maybe it has, maybe it hasn't, but to answer that, first tell me what you're pissed about: The object itself, or the people who think it has indeed become "Fountain"? If you're pissed at the object itself, then unless you categorically hate urinals, even ones you haven't even used, this object has ceased being one, and became "Fountain", whatever that is. If you're pissed at people who consider it "Fountain", then I guess you just disagree with their interpretation of it. My interpretation is, whether this object became art or not after this transformation is irrelevant. What is relevant is what it isn't, which is a urinal. That's the so-called "deep meaning" behind it. It's a conversation about art, but also about language and definitions. Whether you find that kinda thing interesting or not is up to you >I could take a literal turd, smear it on the wall like a coked up chimpanzee, and as long as I make up some crap (get it) "meaning" about it, supposedly this puts it on the same level as the great artwork of the past. Cool, then do it! Let's see what kind of art you can create with a wall and your shit! >Art without meaning is vapid (corporate art for example) but art without aesthetics is a disgrace. You know what, I respect that fully. From Duchamp's wikipedia page: >By the time of World War I, he had rejected the work of many of his fellow artists (such as Henri Matisse) as "retinal," intended only to please the eye. Instead, he wanted to use art to serve the mind. So yeah, maybe Fountain is in fact a disgrace, because it wasn't made to please the eyes, ears, or any part of your body. It wasn't meant to please the audience, but to make the audience think, to start a conversation among the audience. Avant-garde stuff is weird like that. If that's not art by your definition, so be it. Like I said, whether Fountain became art or not is irrelevant. The point is that it is, at the very least, not a urinal.

>>22 Is entropy randomness? How can I make use of it?

I think people focus on negativity more, which in turn means it spreads faster. Seems like an evolutionary thing. It makes more sense to focus on things that are dangerous as a survival mechanism, but this sense has become something unintended. The same phenomenon has happened with stress. I think a good way to spread positivity is to embody it. People respond to someone with positive attitudes, behaviors, and actions. Putting it simply, the best way to spread positivity is to be positive yourself!

>>24 >The same phenomenon has happened with stress. Can you tell me more about this? I know a lot of people who are unable to be stressed

>>25 What I mean is stress evolved as a survival instinct to help us escape and avoid danger. But it isn't meant to be something you experience often or for long periods. Stress in the modern day comes from long-term issues like financial struggles, overwork, relationship issues, etc instead of like.... running from a bear or something. Stress is the silent killer because it wasn't intended to be experienced how we experience it today.

>>24 I, in fact, do not find anything interesting in positivity.